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Hello everybody. And welcome to this episode of the creator come up podcast, where we chat with some creators and talk about how they got to where they are and what they're doing right now. And any insight they have onto just like becoming a creator itself. In this episode, I talk with Chiara from Semrush. Now, Chiara is essentially the face of Semrush. To some extent, I would argue that especially on their YouTube channel, she has been the main face associated with most of the current content, at least up to the last couple of months, speaking with her, it was a blessing. She is a sweetheart. And I learned a lot about the, the creative industry and she's a little bit older than I am. So I took some insight on, uh, some different things that I could, uh, I could learn from her. And maybe you can too, but again, it was a wonderful conversation. I had a lot of fun and I think she did too. So stick around and you'll maybe you'll learn something. Maybe you'll learn a little something from Chiara and I All right. Well, Karen, thank you for being here. Um, Chiara, uh, I say it correctly, as you said that. Okay.

How the correct pronunciation of how an American would say.

Okay, I mean, I have, um, I had a lot of friends back at home that were named Chiara, so I feel like I had some, But ultimately the reason we wanted to have you on the show as one of our first, uh, guests was to more or less, just like, I don't know, you, you seem to be doing well for yourself on the internet spectrum and, and, uh, you know, picking your brain a little bit about how you got there, where you started, what got you to the place you are now and who you met, what you did, like all the things in between and you know, that's all right.

Thank you very much for thinking. I'm very happy that isn't the impression I gave you.

Absolutely like even just like watching your YouTube videos from the last, like from a year ago until now the production value has exponentially gotten better. And it's been really cool to like, even just like for a couple minutes of watching, I can see that you have really upped your game and it's very impressive to see

A lot of work. And now how much of it is you and how much like, do you edit your own videos?

Um, I used to, uh, but I'm trying not to do that anymore just through like increased production and because it's a very, very, very long work. Um, I used to do it started like this. I usually do the rocket edit. So just the mistakes are that they can meet swearing out of the picture and stuff. And then the animations and stuff were added by our motion designers team, because I'm lucky enough to have one. And I'm lucky enough to have people that made those incredibly beautiful animations and transitions and stuff like that. So I gave that to them also because we know designers.

Yeah. I mean, it must be nice having a budget, you know?

Yeah. It is very comfortable. Yeah.

Do you write your own scripts for these things?

Is that where you kind of take the well, we do it in the team. Uh, I worked with a video producer that helps me out with the scripts, but now that I moved to the Italian market is a one woman band. So I'm doing everything from a to Zed, which is incredibly time-consuming from sprints to thinking about the ideas to shooting, to editing all of it, all of it, all of it. And yeah, no, I'm looking now for a video editor just because I don't want it to take all of my time, my, uh, my time to something else, or

Definitely a big headache of like, just being the one woman, man.

Absolutely. I feel you for entirely.

I know that all the graders out there in my vein,

Um, so like, I, I did see that you were a teacher back in the day. Is that correct? Does that, does that help you with, um, writing a lot of your scripts?

It does in the way that I kind of learned the hard way, because I wasn't a very good teacher. So I had a lot of people giving me advice on that. Um, I learned how to explain things to people and sort of like dumb them down in a way that even very hard concepts would be understandable because sometimes grammar is like a mess, uh, especially Italian one, we have tons of rules. So yeah. And having to deal with a product like Semrush with more than 50 tools and stuff ranging from SEO to social media, you have to learn to explain such a complex product to everyone, even those that have started yesterday. So yeah, I would say it helped. Uh, and I would say it also helped in the like, performing way, uh, because I have been used to like being in front of people and actually, yeah,

I was going to ask, yeah, I was going to ask if that, if that even played a role into it, or if you were just a theater kid back in, uh, back in high school and middle school and stuff,

It wasn't, I mean, we don't have that kind of stuff that you guys have, which I find incredibly cool. I would have probably done it if I had lived in the U S but no, um, I guess, um, kind of a natural and the teaching experience also definitely shaped me.

Yeah, no, definitely. I mean, me being the only, the only, I never was a theater kid either, so like, I completely get it. Um, but I did spend all of my time just like wanting to be a YouTuber growing up. So just the idea of just sitting in front of a camera has been a thing, but you literally were in front of actual people, so

But no, I have exactly the same background. Like I was, I literally grew, uh, with YouTube. I subscribed almost immediately. I made an account a little later just because I didn't understand how that back in the day, but yeah. Then yeah, I, I watched YouTube videos my whole life and, uh, yeah, I guess that's also,

Did you watch any like English creators that I might know of?

Cause there's no way that I know about.

I don't know. Uh, I follow a lot of tech YouTubers, so I'm a very, very, very, uh, old fan of MKBHD. Definitely. Yeah.

Marquez is the best beautiful man.

Yeah. He grew so well. Um, and then I'm also a very huge fan of Casey.

And I said by the belief that everyone that is on YouTube is

Everyone around our, I feel like you're only a little bit older than I am, like I assume. Right. You're okay. I'm 24. So 28th. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, we were on the same realm of, of, of Casey was the, was the man VACCA right at college post-college everybody wanted to be him.

Absolutely. And now I have become the biggest fan of his brother and like van is crazy.

I've been saying, I've been seeing, he's been making some content and I saw that Casey kind of promoted it a little bit. What has he been doing?

I don't know. Like I watched him and I understood that incredibly Casey may not be the most creative in the family, really everything from, I don't know, fix fixing cars, making things himself. Like he's surrounded. He has this little studio and he's surrounded by stuff that he made himself like drawers stuff. Everything is easy. He's just, I dunno, the most creative person I've seen and he tells some stories about his life and just about everything. Uh, and he calls himself a spirited man, and the channel is called like that. And I definitely suggest you and anyone who's listening to this to follow that because that channel is crazy.

I 100%, well, I didn't actually know. I thought, I always thought whenever, you know, a big YouTuber promotes like a friend of theirs or something, it's usually a little lackluster. Um, but that's good to know that the whole family is just like providing everything. Yeah.

Well, I don't know what, what happened in that household that they became what they are, but men that was crazy. Yeah. I definitely suggest that.

Okay. Well, I mean, speaking of growing up in, in the household, um, you grew up in Italy. Okay. Um, what did you like, what did you want to do as you grew up? How did you get into, um, I obviously you kind of started in the teaching area. I mean, assuming, um, how did that morph into first off? How did you, what, what, what made you want to do teaching? What made you want to do that? How was your upbringing bringing up?

It actually happened, uh, like most of the things that in my life, uh, I, I very much go with the flow. Okay. So I just regular kid, I did a, what in Italy we call classic studies. Uh, so in high school it's like, you can go for a more, more of a humanistic approach. So we said that led and Greek stuff like that. Um, and after that, I just went into languages because I was very good at English and because I didn't like anything else. Um, and then I, because we have to choose two languages to major in English would be the first one because it was already good at it. And then I went for Russian just because of a challenge, uh, that I regret to this day because of pain. Uh, no, I mean, I love it, but it's really a pain and everybody who's that depression out there

Alphabet. So that is the least of the problems it's like, they have declarations, you have to, it's like speaking Latin, but more difficult. Yeah. It's a whole bunch of things. Yeah. It's, it's crazy.

You, you, uh, you took on a challenge that was like, just like for no point for no reason, but like, that's, that's a real chat.

That is, that is, that is, it was crazy. Uh, and then after that I saw, okay, I, I studied Russian, but I, the speaking part was almost zero because we were way too many, but didn't have time to like practice. So I thought, okay, I should go and do some like, experience abroad and they should go through Russia. Uh, and it kind of happened that a colleague of mine from university was there teaching and he needed a substitute for him coming back to Italy. They needed someone that would go through like, yeah, fill his shoes and teach Italian in English. So I went there, I stayed there for a year in a very remote city, not so remote with kind of remote. Um, and after that I came back to Italy, stayed there a little, but then came back again to Russia this time, these in Petersburg, I studied here a business course, and then I found summers and I never left.

Did you know somebody in Sam rush before?

Or was it just kinda like you just applied and I applied, I started researching it because I didn't know, I didn't know anything. I was a very big fan of marketing and just in general technology, I've always been, um, like I'm, I'm kind of the geek of the family when someone has a problem or like, I need to choose a laptop or a smartphone, they call me and that sort of kid. Uh, but then I just was looking for some sin. I knew what area I wanted it to be in, but I wasn't sure what really I was going to do. And when I found some or they have been through be needing someone also this spoke Italian and I started in the, uh, what used to be the tallying team that was formed by five people. And I was, uh, like my main job was doing webinars and video content. So I started with death and. Yeah, please.

Um, so when you say like webinars and video, uh, video, uh, production or whatever, I was that prior to you being like on the YouTube channel or, okay. So what did you do video production wise? Is it like internal video?

I, uh, started, uh, like thinking about producing content for the YouTube channel. I wasn't doing really anything before that. I mean, I was on camera for the webinars I was hosting, uh, and I was moderating. So I was there for that. Um, we had a YouTube presence, but it wasn't really developed. So I thought, okay, why not? I mean, we use the channel basically just for webinars. And I thought, okay, feels like it's a pretty, uh, like a niche I could go into because no one was really doing that in Italy. Uh, so I started doing that, but I started with like, uh, at my first videos are still on the Italian YouTube channel. They are terrible as all the first videos of everyone they always will be. And they always will be, I'm not taking them down. Uh, and they were made with a webcam and edited with a movie.

So yes, uh, for everybody who started out there, yeah. That's how you're going to start. Uh, and then that's fine and that's fine because you'll grow out of that and you'll grow into more complicated products and it's absolutely fine that your videos are disgusting in the beginning. So do not worry about that. And then I decided, okay, uh, this looks like it's working. And the first time I went to an offline event in Italy, I noticed that people were looking at me and say, Hey, you're the girl that does the videos for Semrush. And then I started realizing that, okay, this is working for real, like, people actually see this stuff, even though the views were not like crazy, you know, but in the, in those small Italian leash that seemed to be working. So I continued,

That's gnarly. That's so cool. That really is really cool. Like, it's cool that like, when you, when you make a video and then you walk into a room and somebody goes, I know you, and you're like, I don't know who you are, but I know why, you know, me, it's really kind of cool.

It is, it is. I have this one story from back in university. I used to make vlogs for college, like my freshman year of logs. So like, if you want to see some really bad videos, you can look at those. But I was sitting there in our quad one day and somebody walked up, like, I was just doing homework. And then somebody like said my YouTube name and I looked up and they were like, thank you for making your videos. And I was like, oh,

Like it hit me. It was like, it's where I peaked in life. But like, yeah, it's the best feeling it is.

It's so cool. And the thing is, is it doesn't even have to be your best content. It doesn't have to be something that you're like you put hours and years of effort into. It's just like doing things, you know, and something that somebody else isn't doing. So actually, I do have a question for you and it kind of pertains to something you said of like, it's okay to be, kind of make a kind of shitty content at the beginning. Um, like, uh, w what's your feeling on the idea that people, I feel like, okay, let me rephrase this. Um, I feel like these days, a lot of people are expecting to blow up on social medias and, and that's kind of like, if they don't make it that way, they don't make it at all. Um, what, what's your, what's your feeling towards that? And the idea of like, it actually takes a little bit of effort in the background.

It takes so much effort. Uh it's like, you always hear you tuber say like day in, day out, you just have to like, put the work in, do that. And that's all, and people don't realize it because it is true. And I know that, uh, probably who's listening to this podcast has heard this phrase a million times, but yeah, you have to do it every single day when you do per se, that it takes time. It, because it does, we see the videos they are done, they're finished, we just hit play. And then for 10 minutes we have some entertainment, but behind that entertainment it's days, if not weeks of work and it's just so much

And years of experience with it.

Yeah. I mean, I know, um, when I started doing videos for the English channel, my English is good, but it's good when I'm speaking to someone, uh, I found myself having a lot of troubles, weeping in a script. And when I see the first videos, I realized that I'm not as natural as I am when I'm, for example, speaking Italian, or when I'm just speaking to a person and it takes work into that. The last videos they're are much better because I have learned to like, rehearse my scripts more and just read more. Cause sometimes just my tongue don't doesn't want to do what it should just, it's not my language so I can try hard, but sometimes it's just not there.

Your English is very good.

Yeah, no it's, uh, but yeah, it does take work and it exploded on social media unless you're very lucky, uh, because we have to always keep in mind that the luck factor is pretty, pretty important, uh, unless you're very, very lucky it's going to take months, years. Uh, and that's just going to be it. Uh, we were talking about MPHD before and he started when he was like, I dunno, 13, 14. Yeah. He wasn't his first, the video is still there. Uh, and you can see it, like he's been putting content out for like 10 years.

Yeah, no, absolutely. It's, it's always it. I dunno. I think a lot of kids these days, or at least a lot of times when I was looking up a bunch of things, we're trying to redo all our thumbnails and whatnot. And I was looking at some newer channels and a lot of them are like your gaming channels, like your Minecraft and stuff like that, that are exploding right now because kids and, you know, just click baity. Um, and then I looked in, like, these people have only been doing videos for like a year or two, and I'm like, this is nuts. Like this isn't normal. And then like having the, the, the experience of like with the MKBHD or even like, I don't know, I used to watch Phillip the Franco and all those guys like building, building up that audience over time is like, I mean, I guess it's longevity, but at the same time, it's also interesting to see these creators that are exploding overnight.

And I'm, I feel like it's that bad that they're, they're the example that people are using

Period short than the law in which you can actually emerge from a specific niche if you have something to actually add up. Uh, but yeah, I believe that it's like one slash two years could be enough if you play your cards. Right.

Absolutely. And, but it's not like the definite that's. I think that's the thing that people need to recognize. I guess, I don't know this, this has always been one of the things that I've always, uh, when I was, when I was back in college, um, and I was acting as a TA for, um, a class, a lot of kids would just be like, oh, I'm just taking these classes and that's kinda it. And I'm hoping to get a job outside. And in my mind, I'm like, you can't do that. Like, there's so much that you have to actually do in order to get like, where you want to go. Like I'm not in, in the final stages of anything, but at the same time, like, it's, there's a lot of things that happen behind the scenes of like working for a lot of people for free for a year, and like doing a lot of this stuff that you don't actually like, nobody talks about that. Nobody knows.

And that's the, that's the. There is a lot of slack that needs to be done before you can actually get any results. But the thing is you can get results, but it doesn't stop there because the real work is not went. And like the work that you put into getting there is the work to do to keep being there, because with so many people putting out content, like you can be forgotten literally in two days. Uh, so it's just like, it's more of a, like a marathon it's super complicated getting to the top, but then you have to keep running. And that's the real problem because, um, you need to be consistent and consistency is still something that I am very much struggling with even having done this for years, because it's just, well.

Creative works hard to, I think that's the thing that people don't realize is it's fun.

It's, it's very hard. Like it's very taxing because it's like, you have to create this entertaining piece while also being informative and like mixing it correctly. And then at the end of the day, like putting it all together in this tight little box and it's like, it's a lot, like, it really is, you know, sitting down to record a five minute video. It's, there's a lot that goes into that if, especially if you want to do it right. I guess.


Yeah. Um, uh, I guess a little different of a question, um, from, from my end, um, what's your feeling on the idea of content moving from a YouTube platform to a Tik TOK? And do you foresee YouTube ever kind of dying out?

Um, I have mixed feelings about this. Um, I liked the doc. I like short content. Um, I don't really, I don't know. I might be wrong. I don't really see it going that, that, that too far, uh, meaning like, okay, it exploded now. It's there. It's gonna stay because we are going always towards short and in short content, but sure. Um, I don't know how much more of a comeback short videos can do. Like they're just going to stay there, but you do always will be the platform where you have everything. Because I feel that now, um, young people go either to a super short content like tick-tock, or they completely substituted TV with stuff like Twitch. So you have your TV, which is your favorite streamer that just comments, whatever, or plays or whatnot, but then you always will go for that shorter in between content.

And actually you can take them off because now it has the shorts and then it has the 10, 15, 20 minutes. And then it has the lives. It doesn't work as well for all those contents in the same platform. So it's not going to be there, but I believe that YouTube will still be the main, uh, like referencing point when you just want to watch a short video. Like, if you think about even like TV shows, like, I don't know, the chemos, the Seth Meyers and stuff, they will always upload their bits. Like SNL. They will always upload everything to YouTube because people will watch that. And

Yeah. Yeah. It can go and take the off that kind of stuff, because you need to have like five, 10 minutes. Uh, but I don't know. I can't imagine myself having, like, I have breakfast with you. I just crawl through like, whatever I feel like. And I know that I have those 10 minutes, which is the time I need to have breakfast and I have something I can watch in between. Like, uh, yeah. I, I don't know. I maybe it's just because I love the platform too much. Uh, but I don't see it going anywhere.

I hope not. They don't know what to have breakfast with.

Exactly. Yeah. I mean, you might have to go over to Twitch then and just watch Twitch streamers. Do you watch Twitch? Are you a Twitch viewer?

To be honest, not so much. Okay. I watch podcasts that are aren't Twitch, but they watch them when they upload them to YouTube. For me, it's always there. I can't, I try to push myself when I get some notifications. Okay. I'll try. And I don't know. I'm just too used to YouTube. I don't find the, I, I can, I don't know. I don't find myself there.

That's it makes sense. You have content at your own disposal at whatever time you want, rather than having to it's like TV, like you said, it's exactly like TV. You have to tune in at the right time. But at the same time, they'll just upload it later. So why, you know?

Yeah. I mean, I know that creators are moving there because it's much more, uh, like it makes much more money than you do. Um, but still, I mean, I wouldn't like to want to change the way I need to make content and the way I think about content, which would mean changing my creativity, creativity to go into something where I just have to talk. Yeah, I know. I know I can do that. I just don't want to have to.

I'd rather just scrip myself out.

I can talk to a camera. That's okay. I don't want to learn anything else, but like, um, so at what point did you like over the years of like with YouTube and everything? Uh, well, not, maybe not even with YouTube, but like what point did you get in your career where you're like, you know what, I'm, I'm now kind of a professional to some extent. Uh, it recently hit me. Uh, some people were just like, you're a professional now. I'm like, I'm still 24. I don't know what you mean.

I was like, oh, I didn't know that.

I'm like, I don't, I don't know how I feel about that. But like, is there, has there been a point in your, in your career that you actually realize that you're like, you know what, I, I kind of like made it to some extent in, in like a professional realm,

Uh, when people say that, but just because I still don't believe it myself, uh, I don't know.

I, I, you know, you probably understand it because you're more or less my age. You, you think of a professional as someone who is much older than we are. Um, so when people like write emails, like inquiring about like some partnerships and stuff, I'm like, whoa, okay, this is in my hands. This is on me. She trusts me. Yeah. I feel the weight of the responsibility. Uh, but I don't really feel the reward. Um, and I feel it when people tell me that I'm a professional, when I collaborate with someone and or they ask me for, I don't know, podcasts like this one, uh, that makes me feel that I made it. Uh, but I don't know if it's imposter syndrome or that our generation is afflicted by, but yeah, I still have that thing that I need to get the recognition by someone else before I actually see it myself.

Sure. Um, but I mean, at the same time you have to, I mean, you're still here and you've accomplished a bunch of things. Uh, how did you, cause like, this is something that I've struggled with, at least not necessarily recently, but, um, actually yeah, a little bit recently, but, um, because that'd be tripped completely.

Let's be, let's be real here. The idea of like just hunkering down and just doing something and getting things done and not having the cause. Like the, the feeling of being a professional comes with a lot of responsibility and that comes with like, somebody will hand you a product and you have to fulfill it. There's no, there's no like this isn't school anymore where like you just get a grade and if it, whatever, you'll take the class next semester, it was like, no, this is like affects other people. How did you, um, do you, have you found a way that like, you've kinda been able to push through that or, um, a mentality that you've adopted? I know this is a little more like philosophical psychology kind of stuff.

No, I get that. I have been struggling with that lately myself, meaning that I have always been used because I was a terrible student, not in the way that I got bad grades, but in the way that I have absolutely no self control and organizational skills that I needed to learn on the, on the job. And so, yeah, I, I started getting that, uh, when I realized that I couldn't work constantly under pressure because procrastinating is awesome when you're 16, not so much when you're 28 and you're like managing the marketing for a whole country and people are actually relying on you for that. So it's something that I definitely learned while I was doing it. And I'm still looking for my way to like perfect in it. Or at least getting to a level where I don't have to, like, I usually go like through some slumps and some incredibly busy work weeks or months. I'm trying to find a balance with that. I guess we all are. Yeah. But yeah. I don't know if this answers your question.

It does. No, it absolutely like, uh, I has there any, I found that like creating, honestly, just creating like to-do lists every single day has helped me a little bit. Cause it like puts it visually. But like, is there anything else that you've done that like, especially being in charge of a whole countries, like

I do the right things with my hands.

I will not them. Okay. I need to have, like I tried because I'm a techie. So I like you to like having like apps, my phone needs to do the stuff for me, but it doesn't work. I tried a billion through the list apps and they work zero. I tried, uh, like the D'Amato timer, like whatever, and it just doesn't work. I have to like take a piece of paper and I write the things down. And then I have three colors which are red, green, and yellow. And I put them by priority and I try to make myself do the red one first. I usually up making them last. Uh, but I try to like have a list of things that I have to do every day and try to like finish them off. Okay. That's the thing that works for me best. But then yeah, of course I need to like have like regular thing cups, uh, with like whoever I am collaborating with at the moment, both in the company and outside just to keep track of all the things that I have to do. And I keep my, I give myself reminders in the calendar, like weeks away.

Oh weeks. Oh, okay. You're you're better than I, I'm going to take a note on that one.

I tried to yell, like you're going to have a meeting or like check with this person now, or you have to answer this email now. Uh, because it just, I won't forget. Wow. It takes time. People tell me, Hey, can you do this now? Because you had to do it last week. So it's starting to work now, but yeah, I've, I've had my share of, uh, being late for, uh, like giving answers and stuff.

Okay. Yeah. That's been my, uh, I have like a fault where like, if I know that something is due and somebody messages me, I just like, like a part of me just ignores the message. Like just don't answer. They don't know that you didn't see it. Like, and it's a horrible thing. It's so bad. It's so bad. So like, I mean, honestly that question was more for me and like maybe somebody else can benefit from it, but it was a little bit more for me

If it helps, uh, especially with emails, uh, I need to have the badge reminded me that there is something that I haven't read.

So I usually read an email. I understand that it's something that I'm going to have to remember. I put it non red. Okay. So that I will see that. And I will have to come back to what is it that I haven't read because I'm one of those psychos that can't have any badges with any numbers anywhere in any app. So I have to clear my inbox. If I see something it's because it's something that I have to clean as soon as possible so that my brain stops telling me there was a notification there. Can you clear it, please?

I love that. Um, I'm the complete opposite. My phone literally has 15 notifications sitting on it. It's it's not good.

Are you one of those people that work like a billion tabs open in. The, no, I am not.

I do not. I know you would think, right? Yeah. I, I that's the one pet peeve of mine is like, I hate walking up to somebody and seeing that they have 300 tabs open and be like, dude, you're not using.

Like, like what, what what's going on there?

It's like this, there's no way you're using all of those tabs. Just close them. Your computer will thank you.

And see what's happening.

And like three of the tabs are YouTube, just like different YouTube videos. And you're like, you're not watching any of those. It's just slowing your computer down. And they wonder why Figma is not working or slack isn't working.

My God. But no, no, I'm not that kind of person. I am the person though that you'll see that I have 900 unread emails and um, 13 unread slack messages. So, uh, you know, I do work for four different companies though. So like it's spread, which is also a thing that I need to also figure out is, uh, not spreading myself too thin, which like, by all means, I don't know if you do any freelance stuff on the side, but good on you for sticking with one company.

No, I, I know myself and I know I couldn't do it.

Yeah. It's, it's, uh, I think I'm starting to know myself too, but I like people too much and I like, I can do that for you. Absolutely. And then I realized, oh man, I do have other things I need to do, but it's too late.

I already told them, I saw a meme recently. Uh, that was like, uh, you replying to an email when someone says like, what's the deadline? When do you think you can have it done by? And you enter a week, like you start typing a week and your brain is like, don't say it because you know, you can't keep that. Don't do it because I know I made that way. I'm trying not to put too much on my plate.

You know what? I might actually start doing that. Cause I think, no, I think people that, I think people really understand that you might not have all like it. Thanks take time. And I think the, the romantic idea of just like getting everything done all the time, like really fast, really productive. It's just not reality. Like, um, at least not for myself. I dunno. You're probably a lot more productive than, than I am in a lot of ways. Shake your head. Absolutely not.

I am. I'm a whisper in that. I am not, I'm trying not to have it heard, but let's be clear.

I think that just like, I guess the idea of setting boundaries is the thing that you also know,

But we use usually, uh, tend to overestimate ourselves.

Uh, so to whoever is listening, no, you can't make it by the time that you decided to it's it's but it's okay. Yeah, yeah, no, yeah. Yeah. Just give yourself a few more, like, I don't know, like seriously, give yourself just more time. Uh, this doesn't mean that you have to be indulgent than just procrastinate every single for the longest amount of time. But I realized that there is a point where you have to just stop and be true to yourself. Like speak the truth. Uh, tell yourself, no, I can't do that. I wish I were that person that can do that, but I'm not.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think it also like, cause if you do continue that mindset, it leads to other issues of just like, whether it be burnout or, or just like, you never end up doing anything, which is great.

I mean, folks let's have a private life as well besides work. So like at that that's important. That's what gives us food and stuff, but we have to live.

I think that's the biggest thing that a lot of people are in this hustle culture of like. I hate that. I find it very romantic and like, I like it a lot. I appreciate it. I just, in practice, it sucks.

It is possible for a specific amount of time, which is how much and how long your body and your mind can handle it. I used to love that as well. I had a period where I fell in love with the hospital culture, and then I was like, okay, yeah, no, I'm going to do that. Then I'm going to do that and that as well. And I'm going to like boss my ass for six to eight months, and then I'm going to be like fine. And no, it doesn't work.

I mean, you grew up watching Casey Neistat. So, you know, that's, that's the whole hustle mentality of a video every day. Also he runs three comp like whatever. It's like, well, if he can do it, I can do it.

It's like, I listened to a recent podcast that he, um, did with Steve-O. Oh, really? Okay. And I definitely suggest you like, take a listen to that. And he says that, like he says, I knew that I, I knew that what I was doing was self-destructive, uh, like he almost brought his marriage to the brink of divorce. And, uh, he wasn't a very present dad. He obliterated his private life to publish one video every day. Yes. Because believe me guys, it does take exactly like 20 hours to make it every single day and like make it at the quality that he did. But he knew that that was going to be time bound, that he couldn't keep doing that for the rest of his life. And that wasn't his goal when he started that he knew that, uh, and then he had to stop when that stuff started working out and give him enough opportunities for him not to have to do that. So he just now makes you two videos whenever he wants to. And that's the whole idea. Like you can do the hustling thing as long as you don't think that that's going to be your life because it can't be, it's not,

No, it's not. It's work in like, unless you have nobody else involved with your life or nothing else involved, like that's, which I, which is not like, if like the guys I work with are here 24 7 and you know what they love it, like in, by all means. That's good for you. Uh, I, I also, I just can't do it.

I like, if you love your job so much, if you cannot do anything else besides that, man, you're blessed. This is awesome. Like the thing that everybody's looking for in life to be satisfied all the time and do something that you actually love, but it doesn't work like that for everybody. And I like, I feel bad for myself and for all the people that fell for that, uh, because yes, it is romantic this great to think, but then boy, it's very big when you end up not making it, then not enabled to carry it on.

Yeah, no, absolutely. It's, it's one of those things where you, you, you don't really take into consideration all of the consequences that come with just doing work all the time. Like I think the biggest thing, well, one of the quotes that I liked from one of his recent videos, Casey's videos was, uh, he talked to, you talked kind of about the idea of taking retirement. Have you seen, if you've seen the video, you know, the one I'm talking about, uh, where he's like, there's the idea of you work your entire life for an end of the period, like end of your life retirement, but instead, why not do small periods of retirement throughout your life? Like where you just take some time to just live? Um, which I, I, I think it's very smart and very healthy to show the audience that he had, um, especially the, the hustle culture audience, um, and show them that that's also an opportunity that people can have. So like, it's that idea of, you're not just doing this for the rest of your life. You're not working 24 7 for the rest of your life.

You like, you have to take breaks and you have to enjoy,

And they appreciate him for saying stuff like that, because he was honest enough to say that he was miserable when he was doing videos and blogs every single day, because it does drive you insane. I can't think of doing it not even for a week. I can't imagine like two years or more.

I barely got through a semester of college like that.

Yeah, it was crazy. But yeah, no, I, I do think that taking some time, especially now, uh, is definitely what we should be looking forward to. I mean, it's, uh, uh, I, I read it the out of the other day. I don't know whose courses is this, but, um, like that we always make our lives around work and we should do the opposite, which is making work around our lives, uh, which is like trying to live and have like something. And then also there is work and not there is work. And then there is also something, so it's a matter of balance. Wow.

That is beautiful. That was the beautiful way to end this. I love it. I'm gonna, I'm gonna try to wrap this up real quick. I do have one last question for you and it's kinda more, I don't know. Um, where do you, where do you see yourself in five years? Where do you want to be? Where do you want to do? Like where, where do you see this taking you?

I think about this almost every day. I would like to open my own YouTube channel and have the little blogging on the side because I've been, um, I dunno, I feel that I need that. Um, like people do journals. I would like to keep a YouTube channel, like the memories of though, to look back when I'm, I don't know, 80. Um, and besides that, I just want to become probably the best marketer I can be, uh, and be a kick-ass, uh, personality in Italy.

That will be definitely, you'll be the top YouTuber of Italy. That's what I'm going for. I hope I manage at least for like marketing and related stuff. I mean, I'll subscribe. Just let me know. We, uh, we're connected on LinkedIn.

Send me, Yeah, I'll try and put, uh, English subtitles. That's our program type studios program. Uh, yeah, we did. We I'll just throw it in. Don't worry about it. Or I'll just learn Italian. Don't worry about it.

That that would be amazing. Even better. Thank you so much. I appreciate you chatting with us. I hope this wasn't too taxing on you.

Great. I have a super fun time and I really hope that all the listeners will have as well. Thank you. Thank you. We do too. So, um, all right, Well, this was really great to do super pleasant. So thank you so much for inviting me again. No, of course.

Thank you. Maybe we'll have you back again when you're a famous YouTuber.

Oh yeah. I would love that to go back to this one and put like little inserts of our previous, uh,

I, 100% send this to you. You can have, you can have this, you can use it. I'll give you permission.

That would be amazing thing. Awesome. Thanks Chiara. You're welcome. Thank you very much and have a great day.

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